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Offline seniya

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #15 on: 28 February 2010, 02:18:32 PM »
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ÂNANDA'S MISDEMEANORS.

   When Ânanda said to Mahâkâçyapa that he was not conscious of any faults, and that therefore there was no reason to exclude him from the assembly, Mahâkâçyapa enumerated several of his (duskrita), which were considered by him to be the proof that Ânanda was still in the stage of training. This incident is said to have occurred, according to some, before the compilation, but according to others, after it. To the former belong the Sarvâstivâda-vinaya, the Sûtra on Kâçyapa's compilation, the Mahâ-prajñâ-pâramitâ-Çâstra, and the Caturvarga-vinaya of the Dharmagupta school; to the latter belong the Vinayamâtrikâ Sûtra, the Pañcavarga-vinaya of the Mahîçâsaka, the Life of Açoka, and the Mahâ-samghika-vinaya. But in the Caturvarga-vinaya, the Mahâsamghika-vinaya,[1] the Life of Açoka, the Pañcavarga-vinaya, the faults of Ânanda are simply enumerated without any reference to his qualification as a member of the Convocation.

[1. Here the accuser is not Mahâkâçyapa, but Upâli.]

   The number of his faults as censured by Mahâkâçyapa or Upâli is variously estimated at six, seven, eight, and nine. The following sums up all that was charged against him:

   1. Ânanda asked Buddha for the admittance of women into the Samgha, in spite of Buddha's prediction that if women were admitted, the Law of the Tathâgata would not long abide on earth.[1]

   2. Ânanda did not ask Buddha for the prolongation of his life, when the latter expressly suggested this to him, by saying that those who were trained in the four supernatural powers could either prolong or shorten their life for the period of one kalpa.

   3. When Buddha preached in parables, Ânanda made, in spite of his presence, some superfluous remark on them.

   4. Ânanda trod on Buddha's golden-colored robe while trying to wash it (a), or while trying to sew it (b).

   5. Being asked by Buddha to give him some water when he was going to enter into Nirvâna, Ânanda gave him muddy water (a), or he did not give him any, even when thrice asked (b).

   6. When Buddha told Ânanda that Bhikshus might dispense with minor precepts, he did not make any inquiry as to what precepts should be regarded minor.[2]

   7. Ânanda exposed the secret parts of Buddha in the presence of women, thinking that the act would tend to the cessation of their passions, but how could he know this when he had not yet attained to the stage of Arhatship?

   8. Ânanda showed the gold-colored body of Buddha to a multitude of women, allowing them to defile it with their tears.

   9. Ânanda first allowed women to worship the remains of Buddha.

   10. When Ânanda was one time reproached by Buddha, he secretly cherished ill-will, and was mischievous to others.

[1. Most of the Chinese books here referred to give all the reasons by which Ânanda justified himself for having committed those alleged misdemeanors, but from want of space, no mention here is made of them.

2. This naturally caused a vehement demonstration among the Samgha later.]

   11. Ânanda was not yet free from the three evil passions: lust, malice, and ignorance, while all the other Bhikshus assembled in the Convocation were free therefrom.

   12. Buddha asked Ânanda three times to serve him as one who offers things (?) to Buddha, but he declined it.[1]

   The number and the order of these faults committed by Ânanda are different in different works.

   In the Sarvâstivâda-vinaya eight faults are counted in the following order: 1, 2, 3, 4a, 5a, 6, 7, 8.

   The Pañcavarga-vinaya counts six in this order: 6, 4b, 1, 2, 5b, 9.

   The Life of Açoka, six: 6, 5b, 4 (simply stepping on Buddha's robe), 2, 7 (the reason given by Ânanda is that he wished to awake in the minds of women the desire to be born as men in their future life), 1.

   The Sûtra on Kâçyapa's Compilation has nine: 1, 2, 10, 4 (simply stepping over the golden robe of Buddha), 5b, 6, 7, 8, 11.

   The Caturvarga-vinaya states seven: 1, 12, 4b, 2, 5b, 6, 8.

   The Mahâsamghika-vinaya describes seven, thus: 1, 2, 4b, 5b, 6, 7, 8.

   The Mahâ-prajñâ-pâramitâ Çâstra has six: 1, 5b,[2] 2, 4 (when folding), 7.

   The Vinaya-mâtrikâ Sûtra merely states that Mahâkâçyapa accused Ânanda for his seven faults, but does not particularise any of them: on the other hand it relates nine disadvantages arising from the admittance of women into the Samgha.

   It is significant that the Sudarçana-vinaya does not make any reference to Ânanda's misdemeanors.

[1. Note how trifling all these accusations are.

2. The fault is viewed here from two points: (1) not giving any water, (2) not knowing the fact that Buddha is able to cleanse any kind of water .]

THE INCIDENT OF GAVÂMPATI.

   The incident of Gavâmpati in connection with the First Convocation is stated in all the Mahâyâna literature and also in some[3] of the Hînayâna. In the Mahâyâna literature we have the following works: The Life of Açoka, the Mahâ-prajñâ-pâramitâ Çâstra, the Sûtra concerning Kâçyapa's Compilation, the Record of the Transmission of the Dharmapitaka, and the Record of the Compilation of the Tripitaka and the Samyuktapitaka. On the other hand, the Vinaya-mâtrikâ Sûtra, the Caturvarga-vinaya, the Pañcavarga-vinaya, and the Sudarçana-vinaya, all of which belong to documents of the Hînayâna class, make no statement about the Gavâmpati incident.

[3. That is, the Sarvâstivâda-vinaya and the Mahâsamghika-vinaya.]

   The incident of Gavâmpati, though it is more or less differently recorded as to its details in different works, is briefly this. Hearing the great bell rung by Mahâkâçyapa, the five hundred Bhikshus[1] hastened to the place of meeting, but when Mahâkâçyapa found that one of them[2] called Gavâmpati[3] had not yet joined them, he asked Anuruddha of the whereabouts of the missing Bhikshu. Being told that he was enjoying a peaceful life in one of the Heavens,[4] he sent a message thither to invite him to the convocation presided over by Mahâkâçyapa. Gavâmpati, who knew nothing about the late events relating to Buddha and his disciples, scrutinisingly asked the messenger why Mahâkâçyapa, instead of the Blessed One himself, stood at the head of the congregation: what was the object of such a grand religious convention, and some other questions.[5] When he was informed of all that had been going on below, he was so greatly afflicted that he said he had now no inclination to descend to the earth, which was made entirely desolate by the eternal departure of Buddha. So saying, Gavâmpati entered into a state of deep meditation, suddenly rose in the air shining with supernatural brilliancy, and then consumed himself in a heavenly fire.[6]

[1. The number of the Bhikshus who took part in the First Convocation is generally estimated at five hundred, but according to the Mahâ-prajñâ-pâramitâ Çâstra, the Convocation consisted of one thousand Bhikshus.

2. According to the Mahâsamghika, two Bhikshus were missing when the members were counted by Kâçyapa, but one of them, Anuruddha, soon joined them.

3. The Mahâ-prajñâ-pâramitâ Çâstra makes him a disciple of Çâriputra.

4. According to some, the Çrîvriksha (?) palace, but according to others the Çrîdeva palace.

5. So in the Sarvâstivâda-vinaya.

6. The Sarvâstivâda-vinaya, the Mahâprajñâ-pâramitâ Çâstra, and the Sûtra on Kâçyapa's Compilation relate, in addition, that four streams ran out of his transfigured body, each murmuring a gâthâ which proclaimed the transiency of life and the lamentable departure of the Lord.]

   The Mahâ-prajñâ-pâramitâ Çâstra says that Gavâmpati having been fully familiar with the Vinaya and the Sûtra, his presence was necessary to the assembly.

   According to the Mahâsamghika-vinaya, Mahâkâçyapa sent several messages to Heaven to summon those Bhikshus who were abiding there, but all of them, having learned that Buddha had already entered into Parinirvâna, were so exceedingly mortified that they disappeared one after another in the same manner. Mahâkâçyapa then declared that no more messages would be despatched to Heaven, nor should those Bhikshus who were living on earth enter into Nirvâna until their work of great importance had been completed.

"Holmes once said not to allow your judgement to be biased by personal qualities, and emotional qualities are antagonistic to clear reasoning."
~ Shinichi Kudo a.k.a Conan Edogawa

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #16 on: 28 February 2010, 02:19:15 PM »
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THE PROCEEDINGS.

   What was done by the Convocation? Were the Vinayapitaka and the Sûtrapitaka alone compiled? Did a compilation of the Abhidharmapitaka also take place? Did any dissension occur in the assembly? These questions constitute the most important part of the First Convocation, and the following abstracts from various Chinese translations are calculated to throw some light on them.

   A. The Vinaya in Four Divisions (Caturvarga-vinaya).--When the cremation ceremony of Buddha was over, all the five hundred Bhikshus went from Vaiçâli to Râjagriha, where Mahâkâçyapa intended to summon the assembly. First, Ânanda was blamed for his seven faults, as already mentioned; then Upâli was requested to recite the Vinaya, beginning with the first of the Principal Sins (Pârâjika), as to the individual, the circumstance, and the nature of the crime. Rules concerning the Bhikshu and the Bhikshuni, the Prâ.timoksha, the Poshadha, the Residing Season, the Wandering Season, the use of leather, the robes, medicaments, the Ka.thina ceremonies,--all these regulations were incorporated in the Vinaya.

   Ânanda was next asked to compile the Sûtrapitaka. Such Sûtras as the Brahma-jâla (translated Brahma-moving), the Ekottara (increasing by one), the Daçottara (increasing by ten), the Formation and Destruction of the World, the Sa.ngîti (chorus), the Mahânidâna (great cause), the Questions of the Çakradeva (Indra), were included in the Longer Âgama (Pâli, Dîgha Nikâyo); those Sûtras of middle length were called the Middling Âgama (Pâli, Majjhima Nikâyo); those in which the subjects were arranged numerically from one to eleven were called the Âgama Increasing by One (A.nguttara Nikâyo); those which were miscellaneously preached for (?) the Bhikshus, Bhikshunis, Upâsakas, Upâsikâs, Devas, Çakra, Mâras, and Brâhmarâjas, were called the Miscellaneous Âgama (Samyutta Nikâyo); and lastly such Sûtras as the Jâtaka, Itivrittika,[1] Nidâna, Vaipulya, Adbhûta, Avadâna, Upadeça, the Explanation of Aphorisms (Nirdeça?), Dharmapada, Pârâyana,[2] Miscellaneous Discussions and several Gâthâs, were comprised in the Miscellaneous Pitaka, (Pâli, Khuddaka Nikâyo, with other matter). The Discursive [Book] (Kathâ Vatthu),[3] the Non-discursive [Book] (Vibha.nga or Puggala paññati?), the Yoking (Dhamma Sanga.ni?), the Correlating (Yamaka?), and the Place of Birth (Pa.t.thâna?) made up the Abhidharmapitaka.[4]

   B. The Vinaya in Five Divisions (Pañcavarga-vinaya).--When the five hundred Bhikshus were assembled in Râjagriha, Mahâkâçyapa inquired of Upâli in due formulary of the four Principal Precepts (Pârâjika) as to the place where they were occasioned, as to the individual with whom they were concerned, and as to the matter with which they dealt. All the Vinaya, for the Bhikshus as well as for the Bhikshunis, was compiled in this way.

   Mahâkâçyapa then asked Ânanda where Buddha taught the Ekôttara Sûtra, the Daçôttara Sûtra, the Mahânidâna Sûtra, the Samgiti Sûtra, the Çrâmañaphala Sûtra, the Brahmajâla (translated Brahmâ-moving), as well as those Sûtras which were preached to Bhikshus, Bhikshunis, Upâsakas, Upâsikâs, Devapûtras, and Devis. When all the Sûtras were thus recited, Mahâkâçyapa declared to the Samgha: "Those longer Sûtras which are now compiled in one group shall be called the Longer Âgama; those Sûtras which are neither long nor short, and are now compiled in one group, shall be called the Middling Âgama; those which are miscellaneously preached to Bhikshus, Bhikshunis, Upâsakas, Upâsikâs, Devapûtras, and Devis, and are now compiled in one group, shall be called the Miscellaneous Âgama; those Sûtras which start with one dharma and increase by one, up to eleven dharmas, and are now compiled in one group, shall be called the Âgama Increasing by One; while the remainder, all consisting of miscellaneous teaching, and now compiled in one group, shall be called the Miscellaneous Pitaka. And to them all shall be given a collective name, Sûtrapitaka. We have now finished compiling the Law, and henceforth let us not put any unnecessary restraint on what was not restrained by Buddha; let us not violate what has already been restrained by Buddha; let us sincerely train ourselves according to the teachings of Buddha."

[1. Not given by Beal.

2. Beal gives the Anâgata-Bhayâni and Munigâthâ.

3. This and following four titles are so concisely given in the text that it is very difficult to make out what they are, and the translation and the reference to the Pâli Abhidharma works here presented are merely tentative.

4. The text is reticent about the author of the compilation of this Pitaka.]

   C. The Vinaya-mâtrikâ Sûtra.--Ânanda being admitted to join the assembly, and the five hundred Arhats having taken their seats, they began to compile the Tripitaka out of the materials which consisted of Sûtras in five or five hundred[1] divisions. Rules for the Bhikshu and Bhikshuni, and the Skandhas (divisions) relating to the Ka.thina and other things composed the Vinayapitaka. The four Âgamas, (1) Long, (2) Middling, (3) Increasing by One, and (4) Miscellaneous--the last one consisting of those Sûtras which relate to Bhikshus, Bhikshunis, the Çakrendra, devas, and Brâhmarâjâs, as well as (5) the sundry collection which comprised the Dharmapada, the Exposition, the Pârâyana, the Upadeça and others,--these five groups of the Sûtras were classified under the Sûtrapitaka. The Discursive (or Dialogical) Treatise (Kathâ vatthu?),

[1. According to other editions.]

the Non-discursive (or Non-dialogical) Treatise (Vibhanga?), the Mutual Enclosing (Dharma Sanga.ni?), the Correlating (Yamaka?), and the Regions (Dhâtu Kathâ or Patthâna?)[1] made up the Abhidharmapitaka. And the general name Tripitaka was given to them all.
D. The Vinaya Text of the Sarvâstivâda School.--Mahâkâçyapa and the five hundred Bhikshus kept the assembly in the Pippâla Cave. He announced that as Bhikshus in coming generations would be inferior in their natural endowment (literally, root, mûla?) and lacking in the power of concentration, the assembly would first compile, for the sake of such, the Gâthâs (verses)[2] in which the Sûtra, Vinaya and Abhidharma[3] were treated in comprehensive brevity. This was done before the meal. They then proceeded to compile the Sûtras. Ânanda was requested by Mahâkâçyapa as well as by the Samgha to select and compile them. Having gone through due formality and having reflected on the impermanence of things, he thought: "Among those Sûtras which I heard personally from Buddha, some are traditional,[4] some are preachings in the Nâga (Serpent) Palace,[5] others are preachings in the heavens.

[1. Those five titles of the books contained in the Abhidharmapitaka closely agree, though the translation is a little different, with those above referred to in the Vinaya in Five Divisions, but the terms being too concise, we cannot give anything more than a mere conjecture as to their correspondence to the Pâli works.

2. Was the Gâthâ already existing side by side with the prose at the time of the First Convocation? Did Buddha himself put some most important tenets of his doctrine into a rhythmical form, that his disciples might learn them by heart? (Yes: See S. B. E., XIII., p. 151.--Edmunds.)

3. Were some parts of the Abhidharma also versified?

4. Does this mean that Buddha preached on some traditional subjects, or that some Sûtras deal with traditions, or that the first sermons of Buddha, such as were delivered for the five Bhikshus in Vârânasî before the conversion of Ânanda, were heard by him afterwards from Buddha's own mouth, or from those who were then present, in which case the term tradition would be used in the sense of hearsay? Judging from similar passages in some other works, the last sense seems to be most preferable.

5 This statement is most significant, for many Mahâyâna texts are said to have been taken from the Nâga Palace where they were long preserved in secret. The Vinaya text of the Sarvâstivâda is generally considered to belong to the Hînayâna work, and this fact makes the above statement much more mysterious. Is the Nâga Palace an ideal creation of later Buddhists? or is it some yet unknown region in the Himâlaya? [Buddha converted several yakkhas, nâgas, etc.--Edmunds.]]

As I keep them all in memory and do not forget any of them, I shall now recite them." All Devas expressed their willingness to listen, and Mahâkâçyapa praised the words of Buddha as the foremost of all doctrines.

   Ânanda then recited the first Sûtra, the Dharmaçakrapravartana (Revolution of the Law-wheel), which was taught in Benâres for the five Bhikshus, one of whom, Ajñâta Kau.n.di.nya, being present in the assembly, told Mahâkâçyapa how at that time he gained the eye of the Law. Hearing this, devas as well as those Bhikshus who were not yet freed from attachment,[1] uttered a pitiful cry as if their hearts were being pierced with thousands of arrows, and lamented that they could not hear those words of Buddha any more from his own mouth. In this lamentation the Bhikshus of the assembly also joined. When they recovered from the shock of deep feeling, Mahâkâçyapa declared that this first Sûtra, taught by the Blessed One, having been accepted by all, should be recognised as the genuine doctrine of Buddha.

   The second Sûtra, Ânanda now went on, which was also preached in Benâres for the sake of the five Bhikshus, consisted in the elucidation of the Four Noble Truths and the Eight Right Paths. Kau.n.di.nya's confirmation and Mahâkâçyapa's conclusion were declared as before.

   The occasion which induced Buddha to preach the third Sûtra was also in Benâres for the sake of the five Bhikshus. He taught that the five Skandhas (aggregates) have no Âtman, that they are subject to transformation, that they cause misery, that one can save oneself from misery through a right comprehension of the nature of things. The conclusion of Mahâkâçyapa was the same as before.

[1. This is very strange, considering that those who were admitted to the assembly were all free from attachment, that is, they were all Arhats; but in spite of this were many other Bhikshus also admitted as the audience, though not actually partaking in the work of the compilation of the Tripitaka? In the Mahâyâna work a statement is sometimes made to the effect that the followers of the Mahâyâna Buddhism had their own convocation somewhere in the neighborhood. Does the present text refer to this, or to the council of the Mahâsanghika school as it is mentioned in Hsüan-Tsang?]

   In this way all the other Sûtras taught by Buddha in several places were recited by Ânanda and confirmed by the Arhats of the assembly. They were all classified in proper forms according to the subject: for example, Sûtras which treated the five Skandhas were grouped under the heading of Skandha, those which treated the six Âyatanas or the eighteen Dhâtus were classified under the Âyatana or Dhâtu; and so on with the (twelve) Chains of Causation, the (four) Noble Truths, the speeches of Çrâvakas, the speeches of Buddha, the (four) subjects of Recollection, the (four kinds of) Right Effort, the (four) Supernatural Powers, the (five) Indriyas, the (five) Balas, and the (eight) Bodhyangas.[1]

   Those Sûtras which are in coincidence with the Gâthâs (verse parts), were called the Coincidence[2] Âgama; those which consist of lengthy teachings, the Longer Âgama; those which are of medium length, the Middling Âgama; those in which the subjects are numerically arranged, the Âgama Increasing by One. "There are," says Mahâkâçyapa, "no other Âgamas than these" now compiled.

   Next, the Convocation proceeded to compile the Vinaya, led by Upâli, who was considered by Buddha to be the first of the Vinaya-dharâ.[3] Being asked by Mahâkâçyapa where, to whom, and on what the first rule of propriety, (Çikshâ)[4] was announced by Buddha, Upâli said that it was in Vârâ.nasi (Benâres) and for the five Bhikshus, and that the matter related to the arrangement of the undergarment. The second Çikshâ was recited by him in the same way.

[1. These subjects also appear in the Abhidharmapitaka, as we see below. Do the statements mean that those subjects as taught by Buddha were classified with the Sûtrapitaka, while a further exposition of the same by his disciples was included in the Abhidharma?

2. Samyukta in Sanskrit. Coincidence is a literal translation of it, which is commonly rendered miscellaneous, according to its derived meaning--so says the text.

3. Literally, those who carry the Vinaya, i.e. , know it by heart.

4. It is very strange that Mahâkâçyapa did not first ask Upâli about the four Principal Sins (Pârâjika), instead of about such insignificant regulations as the Çikshâ rules. Why does the Sarvâstivâda school attach such importance to the latter, while other schools invariably give the first place to the Pârâjika, as is naturally expected? Noticing, however, the in consistent statement which is made immediately below, I am inclined to think that some spurious elements have crept later into the body of the original text.]

   As for the third Çikshâ, the text continues as follows:[1] "Mahâkâçyapa again said to Upâli: Where did the World-Honored One announce the Çikshâ? Upâli replied with a clear, penetrating voice: In Kala.n.daka Village.--For whom?--For Bhikshu Sudinna, son of Kala.n.daka.--What was the matter? If a Bhikshu training himself in the disciplinary rules, commits an adulterous act with another Bhikshu or with an animal, he performs a Pârâjika fault; nor is he allowed to cohabit."[2]

   In this way all the parts of the Vinaya were compiled, which consist of the Pârâjika rules, Samghâvaçesa rules, two Aniyata rules, thirty Naissargika rules, ninety Prâyaçcittika rules, four Pratideçanîya rules, a number of Çikshâ rules, seven Adhikara.naçamatha, as well as the principal rules, obligatory rules, voluntary rules, rules for the Bhikshu, rules for the Upâsaka, regulations of the Karmavâca, conditions for conversion, the Poshadha, the season of residence, the wandering season, general and miscellaneous regulations, and the circumstances which brought forth all these rules and regulations.

   The compilation of the Vinaya being thus finished, it now occurred to Mahâkâçyapa that, as the people in coming generations would be so lacking in intelligence and so poor in natural endowment that they could not comprehend the deep significance of the Doctrine by studying the text only, he himself would recite the Mâtrikâ,[3] that is, Abhidharma, whereby to prevent the spirit of the Sûtra and the Vinaya from being obliterated by arbitrary interpretations. Having obtained the sanction of the Convocation, he comprised under the Mâtrikâ the following subjects: the four Objects of Smriti (recollections), the four Right Efforts, the four Supernatural

[1. The following quotation clearly shows how confusing the text is: "Upâli was asked to recite the third Çikshâ, and is stated to have told them about the first Pârâjika instead." As I remarked just above, the text must be considered to contain some later additions.

2. Literally, to live together.

3. Originally tables of contents, as may be seen in the Pâli texts.--A.J.E.]

Powers (Riddhi), the five Indriyas (lit. root), the five Powers (Bala), the seven Bodhyangas (constituent parts of enlightenment), the Eightfold Noble Path, the four Abhayas (fearlessness), the four Pratisamvids (unimpeded knowledge), the four Çrâmanaphala (obtainment of Çrama.naship), the four Dharmapadas, the Ârañya (solitude), Wish, Knowledge, the Dhyâna of Boundary (the fourth Dhyâna?), Emptiness (Çûnyatâ), Unconditionality (Animitta), Freedom from Desire (Apra.nihita), miscellaneous Disciplines, various Meditations, the Right Entering, Presentation (or perception), Knowledge of Phenomena, Çamatha (tranquilisation), Vipaçyana (insight), the Dharmasamgraha, and the Dharmaskandha.[1]

   When the compilation of the Sûtra, the Vinaya, and the Abhidharma was thus done, the heaven and the earth resounded with the praise of the devas.

"Holmes once said not to allow your judgement to be biased by personal qualities, and emotional qualities are antagonistic to clear reasoning."
~ Shinichi Kudo a.k.a Conan Edogawa

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #17 on: 28 February 2010, 02:20:03 PM »
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   E. The Vinaya text of the Mahâsanghika school.--Having reached at last the state of Arhatship, Ânanda was permitted to join the assembly, which unanimously acknowledged him as the disciple of best memory. They requested him to compile the Dharmapitaka.[2] When Ânanda began to recite, "Thus have I heard: 'Buddha was at one time in the Bodhima.n.dara by the river Nairañjanâ,'" the five hundred Bhikshus showed their deep feeling, which, however, soon passed to the calm reflection that all things which originate from a combination of causes are necessarily subject to ruin and transformation.

   The Dharmapitaka thus compiled by Ânanda consisted of the Longer Âgama; the Middling Âgama; the Miscellaneous Âgama,

[1. Observe that some of those subjects also appear in the Sûtrapitaka, while the identity of others cannot be determined, owing to the brevity of the statement.

2. According to some the Dharmapitaka is identified with the Sûtrapitaka, as in the present text; while, according to others, it is a general name given to the entire collection of the sacred writings. This disagreement among the records of different Buddhist schools apparently shows that at the earlier stage of development of Buddhist literature there was no definite name for the Pitaka compiled by the First Convocation, which had probably been known by the simple designation, Buddhavâcâ (Words of Buddha). Therefore we shall not run much risk in considering those terms which are now currently used by Buddhists themselves, as well as by Buddhist scholars, (to-wit, Vinayapitaka, Sûtrapitaka, Abhidharma, Tripitaka or Dvipitaka), as the elaboration of later Buddhists.]

which was so called because of its dealing with miscellaneous subjects concerning predisposition (lit. root, mûla), power (bala), enlightenment (bodhi), and the path (mârga); and the Âgama Increasing by one, which was so called because of a numerical arrangement of subjects from one up to one hundred:[1] while the Miscellaneous Pitaka comprised the Udâna (narratives), Itivrittika (incidents), and Nidâna (circumstantial notes), relating to Pratyekabuddhas and Arhats, which are written in verses (Gâthâ).[2]

   Upâli, who was announced by Buddha as well as by the Sa.ngha as the first of the Vinaya-dharâ, was asked next to compile the Vinaya text. He first told the Convocation that there were five sorts of purity, and then proceeded to censure Ânanda for having committed the seven faults as stated elsewhere, two of which, however, Ânanda refused to acknowledge.[3]

   Upâli is said to have then recited the nine divisions of the Vinaya, to wit, (1) Pârâjika, (2) Samghâvaçesa, (3) two Aniyatas, (4) thirty Naissargika, (5) ninety-two Prâyaçcittika, (6) four Pratideçanîya, (7) Çikshâ, (8) seven Adhikara.naçamathas, and (9) rules conforming to the Doctrine. He also explained in addition various meanings of the Vinaya: for example, as to the distinction between the dreadful sins (pârâjika) and serious offences (sthûlâtyaya), or as to a different classification of the Vinaya-text. When thus they had finished compiling the Pitaka, the ten hundred Bhikshus staying outside[4] were called in and informed of the work of the Convocation.

[1. The reader will observe that the number of the subjects contained in the "Âgama increasing by one" differs in different texts.

2. This statement is very valuable. The Mahâsa.nghika quarreled with the Theravâda about the contents of the Khuddaka Nikâya, where these books belong, and the very treatises which the Dîpavamsa says they omitted, are wanting here.--Edmunds.

3. It is noteworthy that according to the Mahâsamghika school the man who blamed Ânanda before the assembly was not Mahâkâçyapa, but Upâli, the first of the Vinaya-dharâ.

4. What does the statement here refer to, which says one thousand Bhikshus staying outside were summoned in? Hsüan-tsang mentions that the Mahâsanghika school, being excluded from the assembly of the Sthavira school, had their own compilation, meeting to the west of Mahâkâçyapa's convocation. Does the present text refer to that?]

   A vehement discussion now arose in the assembly as to what was meant by Buddha when he said to Ânanda that the precepts of minor importance could be dispensed with. A certain group of six Bhikshus went so far to the extreme as to say that "if the World-Honored One were still living, he would have everything at once abolished." Mahâkâçyapa, whose majestic dignity and authority were equal to those of Buddha, then sternly ordered them to keep silence, and made a declaration that all which had ever been forbidden should be forbidden, and what had not been forbidden should not be forbidden, and that they should not give any chance to the heretics who were willing to blame the congregation at all costs.

   The text concludes with a list of the venerable masters through whom this knowledge of the First Convocation was lineally transmitted down to the venerable Tao-lih (Bodhibala?).[1]

   F. The Sudarçana-vinaya.--When the five hundred Bhikshus were seated, Mahâkâçyapa asked them what they would first compile, the Dharmapitaka or the Vinayapitaka, and to this they answered: "Venerable Sir, the Vinayapitaka is the life of Buddhism, and so long as the Vinayapitaka exists, Buddhism will also exist. Therefore, let us first produce the Vinayapitaka."

[1. Why not give names, so as to compare with Theravâda list in Mahâvamsa?--Edmunds.]

   The next question was who should be the principal compiler of it: Upâli suggested that Ânanda could be chosen for the position, but it was not accepted by the assembly. Being recognised by Buddha as the first of the Vinaya-dharâ, Upâli himself was prevailed upon to recite the Vinaya by a general vote. After due formulary he produced all parts of the Vinaya which consisted of the Prâtimoksha of Bhikshu and Bhikshuni, and Skandhaka, and the Parivâra.

   Mahâkâçyapa then nominated Ânanda, according to a general wish of the Sangha, to compile the Dharmapitaka. The Brâhmajâla and the Çrâmaña-phala were first recited, and then all the five divisions of the Sûtra, which consist of the Longer Agama Sûtra, the Middling Agama Sûtra, the Samyukta Sûtra, the Anguttara Sûtra, and the Khuddhaka Sûtra, the last one containing all the words of Buddha (Buddha-vâcâ) not included in the first four Âgamas.[1]

   The speeches of Buddha, the text goes on to say, are of one taste, have two functions, and are divisible into three periods: that is, they all teach the means of deliverance (moksha) which consist in morality, meditation, and understanding; they are composed of the Dharmapitaka and the Vinayapitaka; they are divisible into the first speech, the last speech, and those speeches which were delivered between them. The text then raises the question: What is the Tripitaka? to which is given the answer that it consists of Vinayapitaka, Sûtrapitaka, and Abhidharmapitaka, together with their analytic explanation.[2] The contents of the Tripitaka given in this way agree with those of the Pâli collection.[3]

   G. Mahdprajñâpâramitâ Çâstra.[4]--Mahâkâçyapa in a friendly way requests Ânanda to compile the Dharmapitaka, saying: "Though there were many great disciples of the Buddha to whom the guarding of Dharmapitaka was entrusted, they are now all gone except you. Therefore, out of the compassion for all beings and in accordance with the spirit of Buddha, you shall compile the Buddhadharmapitaka." Thus requested, Ânanda ascends the lion-seat, and reverentially turning towards the place where Buddha's Nirvâna took place, says: "Though I did not personally hear the first preaching of Buddha, I have learned it by hearsay. When Buddha was in Vârâ.nasî, he first opened the gate of nectar for the five Bhikshus and preached the Four Noble Truths of Suffering, Amassing, Cessation, and the Path. Ajñâta Kau.n.dinya was the first to perceive the Path, and 80,000 devas also all entered upon the Path."

[1. The Pâli commentaries say the same.--A. J. E.

2. This is very strange, because the text bas before said that the First Convocation compiled the Vinaya and Sûtra only. I am inclined to think that these additional statements, as well as the succeeding detailed explanation of such terms as Sûtra, Abhidharma, Pitaka, and Âgama, are later interpolations put down here by way of commentary, but which in the course of time have been mixed up with the text.

3. The Chinese characters for transliteration in the present text, so far as they have come under my notice, strongly suggest that the text is a translation of the Pâli original, though I have retained the Sanskrit terms for the sake of uniformity.

4. The present text belongs to the Mahâyâna literature, and it will be very interesting to contrast its accounts of the First Convocation with those of the preceding ones, which all belong to the Hînayâna Buddhism.]

   When the one thousand Arhats assembled in the Convocation heard the words of Buddha as recited by Ânanda, they were greatly afflicted with the thought that they could no more hear Buddha's personal address. The Sthaviras Anuruddha and Mahâkâçyapa expressed in verses their deep feelings about the impermanence of things.

   Mahâkâçyapa told Ânanda that all the teachings of Buddha, from the Dharma-cakra-pravartana Sûtra down to the Mahâparinirvâna Sûtra, should be classified in four divisions, each being called an Âgama, viz.: the Âgama Increasing by One, the Middling Âgama, the Longer Âgama, and the Coincidence Âgama.[1] And to them all was given a general name: Sûtradharmapitaka.

   Upâli, who was recognised by the Samgha to be the first of the Vinaya-dharâ among the five hundred Arhats,[2] was then asked to recite the Vinaya consisting of eighty divisions.[3]

   Lastly, Ânanda was again requested to recite the first Abhidharma taught by Buddha, as he was acknowledged among the five hundred Arhats to be most conversant with the exposition of the Sûtra. He addressed the Sangha: "Thus have I heard: Buddha was at one time in Çrâvasti, when he told the Bhikshus that those who neither removed nor exterminated the five dreadful [sins], the five misdemeanors, and the five sorts of malice, would suffer in consequence innumerable misfortunes in this life, bodily as well as spiritual, and in the future would fall down into the evil paths; that those, however, who were free from these five dreadful [sins], five misdemeanors, and five sorts of malice, would enjoy in consequence various blessings in this life, bodily as well as spiritual, and in the future be born in a pleasant heavenly abode. What are those five dreadful [sins] which are to be kept away? They are: (1) killing, (2) stealing, (3) unlawful lust, (4) lying, and (5) drinking spirits."

[1. A literal translation of Samyuktâgama.

2. Here, as well as further on, five hundred Arhats are mentioned. Is this the number of the Arhats assembled in the Convocation? If so, it is in direct contradiction to the above statement that there were a thousand.

3. One edition reads eight thousand, which is probably a misprint.]

   All such matters were comprised under the Abhidharmapitaka. Thus ended the compilation of the three Dharmapitakas.

INCIDENT OF PURÂNA.

   Three[1] out of the eleven Chinese translations which contain accounts of the First Convocation refer to the episode of Purâ.na, who was in the south[2] when Mahâkâçyapa and five hundred Bhikshus were working on the compilation of the Pitaka. According to the Caturvarga-vinaya, the event occurred in the following manner:

   Having heard that the Convocation was taking place in Râjagriha, Sthavira Purâ.na hastened thither, accompanied by his party, which consisted of five hundred Bhikshus. He went to Mahâkâçyapa and asked if he also might be allowed to learn all that had happened. Mahâkâçyapa thereupon again summoned the assembly, requested Upâli to rehearse what he had recited, and had other things repeated as they had been done before. Purâ.na expressed his satisfaction with the general proceedings of the Convocation, except as to the insertion of the following eight indulgences, which had been plainly approved by Buddha, and unmistakably kept in memory by himself. The eight things were: (1) Keeping food indoors; (2) Cooking indoors; (3) Cooking of one's own accord; (4) Taking food of one's own accord; (5) Receiving food when rising early in the morning; (6) Carrying food home according to the wish of a giver; (7) Having miscellaneous fruits; (8) Eating things grown in (or by?) a pond.

   These indulgences, said he, were not against the rule that forbids the taking of the remnant of food. Mahâkâçyapa told him that he was correct in saying so, but that Buddha permitted them only on account of a scarcity of food, when the Bhikshus could not get a sufficient supply of it by going their rounds, and that therefore when this circumstance was removed, Buddha again bade them to abstain from these eight indulgences. Purâ.na, however, protested, declaring that Buddha, who was all-wise, would not permit what otherwise was forbidden, nor would he forbid what otherwise was permitted. To this Mahâkâçyapa replied: "The very reason of his being all-wise has enabled him to permit what otherwise was forbidden, and to forbid what otherwise was permitted. Purâ.na, we will now make this decision: That whatever Buddha did not forbid shall not be forbidden, and whatever Buddha forbade shall not be disregarded. Let us train ourselves in accordance with the disciplinary rules established by Buddha."

[1. The Pañcavarga-vinaya, the Caturvarga-vinaya, and the Vinaya-mâtrikâ.

2. According to the Pañcavarga-vinaya, agreeing with the Pâli.]

   The Pañcavarga-Vinaya mentions, instead of the eight above enumerated, seven indulgences which, however, may be taken for eight, according to how we punctuate the passage, though the text apparently states "these seven things." They are slightly different from those in the Caturvarga-vinaya, to-wit: (1) Keeping food indoors; (2) Cooking indoors; (3) Cooking of one's own accord; (4) Receiving food in compliance with the wish of another; (5) Taking fruit of one's own accord; (6) Receiving things coming out of a pond; (7) Eating fruit with its seeds (or stone) removed, when received from one who is not a regular attendant in the Samgha.[1]

   According to the Vinaya-mâtrikâ Sûtra, the first of the eight indulgences is the keeping of food indoors, and the last is the eating of sundry grasses and roots (or roots of grass) growing by a pond, but the six intermediate ones are not mentioned.

   Mahâkâçyapa is said to have told Purâ.na about the eight excellent qualities of Buddha, by virtue of which he could, when deemed fit, establish or abolish the rules for the benefit of the Samgha.

PLACE AND TIME.

   All the Chinese works, already referred to, agree in stating that the First Convocation took place in Râjagriha, though they differ as to the special locality of the city. The Saptapar.na Cave, the Pippala Rock, the Kshatrya Cave, and the Gridhrakûta are the places thus mentioned in them.

[1. The last passage is not clear, and we may consider it either as forming an independent statement or as an appendix to the sixth.]

   As to the time, they unanimously say that the event happened immediately after the demise of Buddha, though they in no wise agree regarding the exact date.

TEITARO SUZUKI.

Sumber: http://www.sacred-texts.com/journals/mon/1stbudcn.htm

Semoga bermanfaat.....
"Holmes once said not to allow your judgement to be biased by personal qualities, and emotional qualities are antagonistic to clear reasoning."
~ Shinichi Kudo a.k.a Conan Edogawa

Offline Peacemind

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #18 on: 28 February 2010, 06:11:01 PM »
 [at] Seniya:
 
Kirimannya sangat bermanfaat! Thanks a lot!

Memang ada beberapa perbedaan mengenai kronologi Konsili Agung pertama antara tradisi Theravada dan tradisi2 lainnya. Dalam tradisi Theravada, Konsili Agung pertama secara lengkap telah dijelaskan dalam Samantapāsādika dan Sumaṅgalavilasini. Sayangnya, sekarang masih sulit untuk mendapatkan terjemahan kitab ini dalam bahasa Inggris. Jika di antara teman2 yang memilikinya, ini akan sangat membantu sekali sebagai studi banding.

Sebagai tambahan.....

Btw, dalam Samantapāsādika, ada beberapa alasan mengapa Mahā Kassapa berniat untuk mengadakan Konsili. Selain karena pernyataan Bhikkhu Subaddha yang ditahbiskn ketika sudah tua (Vuḍḍhapabbajita - kata memiliki kemiripan dengan pendapat tradisi yang mengatkan bahwa nama bhikkhu ini adalah Mahallaka atau Subhadra Mahallaka karena Mahallaka juga berarti 'tua'), juga ada alasan2 lainnya. Sebagai contohnya, Mahā Kassapa ingat kata2 Sang Buddha bahwa setelh Sang Buddha meninggal, Dhamma dan Vinaya akan menjadi guru para pengikutnya. Juga ia ingat bagaimana suatu kali Sang Buddha bertukar jubah dengannya. Kejadian ini mengingatkan Mahā Kassapa bahwa ia memiliki tanggung jawab untuk melindungi ajran Sang Buddha setelha beliau meninggal.

Di artikel yang dikirim saudara Seniya ada satu alasan yang dilontarkan beberapa tradisi bahwa pelaksanaan Konsili bertujuan untuk menghindari celaan dari kaum heretics (penganut ajaran lain) bahwa Vinaya yang ditetapkan Sang Buddha tidak ubahnya asap yang dipraktikkn pengikutnya hanya ketika beliau masih hidup. Dalam tradisi Theravada, seperti yang tercatat dalam Pancasatikakkhandhaka, dikatakn bahwa alasan ini berkaitan dengan penetapan Mahā Kassapa untuk tidak melenyapkan beberapa peraturan minor (Khuddhānukhudhhasikkha).

Mengenai Bhikkhu Ānanda, Bhikkhu Māha Kassapa pada awalnya hanya menunjuk 499 arahat sebagai peserta karena beliau ingin memberikan peluang kepada bhikkhu Ānanda. Beliau berpikir bahwa tanpa dan dengan Ānanda, konsili tidak akan terlaksana. Tanpa Ānanda, konsili tidak akn terlaksana karena Ānanda adalah the treasurer of Dhamma. Tetapi jika Ānanda bergabung beliau belum mencapai kesucian Arahat padahal ada ribuan bhikkhu lainnya yang sudah mencapai arahat. Jika Mahā Kassapa menunjuk Ananda sebagai salah satu partisipan Konsili, nanti akan ada banyak kritik dari bhikkhu2 lain. Oleh karena, hanya setelah bhikkhu2 lain meminta beliau untuk mengikut-sertakan Ananda, beliau kemudian menunjuknya. Dan Ananda dikatakn berusaha mempraktikkan praktik yang keras untuk mencapai kesucian arahat karena beliau disindir oleh seorang arahat dalam sebuah pertemuan sehari sebelum konsili berlangsung bahwa ada seseorang (yakni beliau) di antara bhikkhu2 yang berkumpul yang masih berbau daging mentah.  Selain itu berbeda dari beberapa tradisi lainnya, tradisi Theravada hanya mencatat 6 kesalahan Bhikkhu Ānanda yang beliau lakukan sebelum dan sesudah Sang BUddha parinibbāna dan harus diakui ketika Konsili Agung pertama berlangsung.

Berhubungan dengan Bhikkhu Gavampati, Theravāda memang tidak mencatat tentang bagaimana Gavampati diundang untuk menghadiri Konsili ketika beliau berdiam di alam Sorga. Namun demikian, tradisi Theravada juga mencatat tentang kebiasaan bhikkhu Gavampati untuk bermeditasi di alam Sorga.

Berkaitan dengan Bhikkhu Purana, tradisi Theravada hanya mencatat bahwa beliau datang ketika Konsili telah selesai dan beliau mengatakan bahwa terlepas dari apapun keputusan yang ada di Konsili itu, beliau hanya berpegang pada ajaran yang beliau sendiri dengar langsung dari Sang BUddha.

Be happy!

Offline seniya

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #19 on: 28 February 2010, 06:32:13 PM »
 [at] Peacemind:
Sama2, bro, memang menarik sekali kalau bisa membandingkan persamaan dan perbedaan kisah Konsili Pertama menurut tradisi2 Buddhis awal......

Soal Bhikkhu Purana yang kembali setelah Konsili Pertama selesai dan memiliki versi Vinaya sendiri soal beberapa peraturan kecil, apakah ini menunjukkan awal perbedaan pendapat tentang Vinaya yang menyebabkan perpecahan Sangha pada masa2 berikutnya seperti pada Konsili Kedua dst?

Kemudian aoakah perpecahan Sangha menjadi berbagai aliran mulanya hanya perbedaan pada Vinaya, seperti pada Konsili Kedua di mana sekelompok bhikkhu Vajji melakukan 10 perbuatan yang melanggar Vinaya yang telah ditetapkan dalam Konsili Pertama dikeluarkan dari kelompok Sangha awal dan membentuk kelompok Sangha sendiri (Mahasanghika)?
"Holmes once said not to allow your judgement to be biased by personal qualities, and emotional qualities are antagonistic to clear reasoning."
~ Shinichi Kudo a.k.a Conan Edogawa

Offline Peacemind

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #20 on: 28 February 2010, 07:00:41 PM »
[at] Peacemind:
Sama2, bro, memang menarik sekali kalau bisa membandingkan persamaan dan perbedaan kisah Konsili Pertama menurut tradisi2 Buddhis awal......

Soal Bhikkhu Purana yang kembali setelah Konsili Pertama selesai dan memiliki versi Vinaya sendiri soal beberapa peraturan kecil, apakah ini menunjukkan awal perbedaan pendapat tentang Vinaya yang menyebabkan perpecahan Sangha pada masa2 berikutnya seperti pada Konsili Kedua dst?

Kemudian aoakah perpecahan Sangha menjadi berbagai aliran mulanya hanya perbedaan pada Vinaya, seperti pada Konsili Kedua di mana sekelompok bhikkhu Vajji melakukan 10 perbuatan yang melanggar Vinaya yang telah ditetapkan dalam Konsili Pertama dikeluarkan dari kelompok Sangha awal dan membentuk kelompok Sangha sendiri (Mahasanghika)?

Meskipun tradisi Theravada tidak mencantumkan persoalan vinaya antara bhikkhu Purana dan keputusan konsili pertama, ada beberapa sarjana Buddhist yang berpendapat demikian, bahwa kejadian ini merupakan semacam bibit perpecahan / lebih tepatnya perbedaan pendapat  di antara komunitas para bhikkhu.

Berkaitan dengan perpecahan yang terjadi di konsili kedua yng mengakibatkan perpecahan Sangha kedalam dua kelompok, tradisi theravada hanya berpatokan pada perbedaan 10 peraturan yang diimplementasikan oleh para bhikkhu dari Vajji. Namun demikian,vasumitra dan vinitadewa dari Sarvastivada mengatakn bahwa perpecahan ini disebabkan karena 5 pendapat Mahādewa yang menunjukkn kelemahan para arahat. Dikatakn Mahadewa  bahwa arahat masih memiliki nafsu birahi (rāga), kebodohan, keragu-raguan, harus mencapai araht atas bantuan orang lain, dan mencapai kearahatan dengan berteriak 'aho'.  Jadi sementara tradisi Theravada mengatakn perpecahan Sangha semata-mata karena alasan Vinaya, tradisi lain berpendapat bahwa karena filsafat yang berbeda perpecahan terjadi dalam Sangha.

Be happy!

Offline Indra

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #21 on: 28 February 2010, 07:07:10 PM »
bukankah ada kontrak antara Sang Buddha dan Ananda, bahwa segala sesuatu yang dibabarkan oleh Sang Buddha kepada orang lain yg tanpa sepengetahuan Ananda maka Sang Buddha harus mengulangi lagi untuk Ananda. Jika ada Ajaran yg dibabarkan kepada orang lain yg tidak diulangi untuk Ananda, ini berarti Sang Buddha melanggar kontrak, apakah mungkin?

Offline Peacemind

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #22 on: 28 February 2010, 07:51:12 PM »
bukankah ada kontrak antara Sang Buddha dan Ananda, bahwa segala sesuatu yang dibabarkan oleh Sang Buddha kepada orang lain yg tanpa sepengetahuan Ananda maka Sang Buddha harus mengulangi lagi untuk Ananda. Jika ada Ajaran yg dibabarkan kepada orang lain yg tidak diulangi untuk Ananda, ini berarti Sang Buddha melanggar kontrak, apakah mungkin?

Saya sebenarnya masih kurang jelas mengenai kontrak ini. Kita tahu bahwa bhikkhu Ānanda diminta sebagai pembantu utama Sang Buddha, 20 tahun setelah pencapaian Sammāsambuddha sang Buddha. Artinya, kontrak ini ditetapkan 20 tahun setelh Sang Buddha mencapai penerangan sempurna. Jika kontrak ini mengacu kepada semua khotbah Sang Buddha sejak beliau mencapai penerangan sempurna, berarti Sang BUddha harus mengulangi semua khotbah beliau termasuk khotbah2 20 tahun sebelumnya yang Sang Buddha belum babarkan ke bhikkhu Ānanda. Selama 20 tahun sebelum Bhikkhu Ānanda menjadi pembantu utama, tentu banyak khotbah yang beliau belum pernah dengar karena tidak terus menerus beliau bersama-sama Sang Buddha. Kalau khotbahnya sedikit, mungkin Sang Buddha bisa mengulangi ke Bhikkhu Ānanda. Coba kalau selama 20 tahun itu, banyak sekali khotbah2 yang bhikkhu Ānanda belum pernah mendengar, pertanyaanya apakah Sang BUddha memiliki waktu untuk mengulangi semua. Mungkin ada pendapat dari teman2 di sini.

Offline bond

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #23 on: 28 February 2010, 07:55:01 PM »
 [at]  Samanera Peacemind.

Apa yg saya pernah dengar , Bhikkhu Purana adalah juga seorang arahat...benarkah demikian..(menurut versi theravada)?
« Last Edit: 28 February 2010, 07:57:11 PM by bond »
Natthi me saranam annam, Buddho me saranam varam, Etena saccavajjena, Sotthi te hotu sabbada

Offline Peacemind

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #24 on: 28 February 2010, 08:06:44 PM »
[at]  Samanera Peacemind.

Apa yg saya pernah dengar , Bhikkhu Purana adalah juga seorang arahat...benarkah demikian..(menurut versi theravada)?

Menurut Malalasekera dalam Dictionary of Pali Proper Names, mengutip pernyataan Samyuttanikāya Atthakatha, Vol. iii, 215, Bhikkhu Puraṇa masih seorang Sotapanna.

Offline Riky_dave

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #25 on: 28 February 2010, 08:08:18 PM »
:)
Langkah pertama adalah langkah yg terakhir...

Offline bond

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #26 on: 28 February 2010, 08:10:15 PM »
[at]  Samanera Peacemind.

Apa yg saya pernah dengar , Bhikkhu Purana adalah juga seorang arahat...benarkah demikian..(menurut versi theravada)?

Menurut Malalasekera dalam Dictionary of Pali Proper Names, mengutip pernyataan Samyuttanikāya Atthakatha, Vol. iii, 215, Bhikkhu Puraṇa masih seorang Sotapanna.

Terima kasih Samanera untuk konfirmasinya.  _/\_
Natthi me saranam annam, Buddho me saranam varam, Etena saccavajjena, Sotthi te hotu sabbada

Offline Riky_dave

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #27 on: 28 February 2010, 08:13:09 PM »
Mungkin tidak bahwa seorang Arahatta mengucapkan kalimat kasar?Koq jadi berbanding ya...??
Langkah pertama adalah langkah yg terakhir...

Offline Riky_dave

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #28 on: 28 February 2010, 08:15:33 PM »
Nanya sekalian Soal Dhammacakkapavatana Sutta[Khotbah pertama SB],,,

Apakah "valid" dikatakan sebagai "khotbah pertama"?padahal sebelum menuju ke 5 pertapa,Buddha bertemu dengan seorang pertapa dan pertapa itu menanyakan ,"Siapa Buddha,Guru Buddha siapa"..Buddha menjawab,"Saya adalah yang telah mencapai Penerangan Sempurna.."
Ketika hal tersebut terjadi,si petapa menjawab,"Mungkin ya,mungkin tidak.." dan pergi berlalu begitu saja,apakah ini bisa dikategorikan bahwa Buddha gagal dalam Khotbah "pertama" nya kepada petapa tersebut??

Saya juga tertarik dengan Sangha Agung 1 dan seterusnya,ada yang memiliki "sejarah"nya dan linknya?boleh saya minta untuk dibaca?

Anumodana _/\_
Langkah pertama adalah langkah yg terakhir...

Offline bond

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Re: Sutta dongeng???
« Reply #29 on: 28 February 2010, 08:18:05 PM »
 [at] Samanera Peacemind

Saya mau tanya lagi apakah Samyutanikaya atthakata itu termasuk kitab komentar?, yang saya tau itu adalah kitab komentar CMIIW
Jika ya....apakah dalam sutta ada menyebutkan tingkat kesucian Bhikkhu Purana ini selain samyutanikaya atthakata?
« Last Edit: 28 February 2010, 08:39:04 PM by bond »
Natthi me saranam annam, Buddho me saranam varam, Etena saccavajjena, Sotthi te hotu sabbada